Zazaîstan - Kurdistan - Luristan

[Vladimir]

Qaymeqamê qedexekar selawata zazakî jî qedexe kir

Weşandin:1/3/2007 saet 23:00

Qaymeqamê Pîranê Mustafa Altipinar di dema ku li rojavayê Tirkiyeyê li navçeya Sutculera bajarê Ispartayê qeymeqamtî dikir me nave wî bi qedexekirina pirtûkên Orhan Pamukî bihîst

Qeymeqamê Pîranê Mustafa Altipinar di dema ku li rojavayê Tirkiyeyê li navçeya Sutculera bajarê Ispartayê qeymeqamtî dikir me nave wî bi qedexekirina pirtûkên Orhan Pamukî bihîst. Altipinar bi fermana xwe pirtûkên Orhan Pamukî li Kitibxaneyan qedexe kiribû û piştre jî dewletê ew sirgûnî navçeya Diyarbekirê, Pîranê kir.



Piştî qeymeqam hat Pîranê li vir jî dest pê kir bi serê xwe hin tişt qedexe kirin. Pêşiyê qede kir ku şanoya NÇM bi kurdî şano neke.



Piştre jî sahaya futbolê a ciwanan girt, ne hişt ciwan futbolê bileyzin. Herî dawî jî qeymeqam dîwarek bilind xist navbera xaniyê xwe û yê serokê şarederiya Pîranê û got “heger DTPyî ji min razîbûna ezê ji qehran bimirama.”



Qeymeqam Altipinar nuha jî li navçeya Pîranrê qedexe kir ku di cenazeyan de bi zazakî salawat neyê xwendin û dîsa ferman da ku selawat bi tirkî bên xwendin.



Muftuyê Pîranê Arif Yesiloglu dibêje ”di cenazê jinek ku duh wefat kiribû me selawat bi tirkî xwend. Berê me selawatan bi zazakî dixwend lê nuha ferman heye em mecbûrî bi tirkî dixwînin. ”



Serokê şarederiyê Abdullah Akengin jî got ”bi salan e em bi zazakî selawatan dixwînin. Ev zimanê gelê me ye ku jê fêm dikin. Gel naxwaze bi tirki selawat bên xwendin. Selawat bi zazakî bê xwendin ne li dijî erka misilmantiyê ye. Divê selawat bi zimanê ku gel jê fehm dike bê xwendin. Di cenazê de ji ber ku selawat bi birkî bûye kes beşdarî cenazê ne bûye. Heke zazakî bûna ê gelek kes beşdar bibûna. ”



Qaymeqam Mustafa Altipinar got ew naxwaze di vî warî de dîtinên xwe bêje.



Cigira waliyê Diyarbekirê Canan Hancer Başturk dibêje ev biryara muftî ye ku ê bi kîjan zimanî bixwîne. Tiştê ez zanim selawat bi erebî tê xwendin. Demekê bi kurdî ji hat xwendin. Qeymeqam nikare midaxale bike. Lê hemû memûrên navçeyê di bin emrê qeymeqam de ne. Qeymeqam kare ferman bide û lêpirsînê bike. Lê ji ber ku mijar olî ye hesas e. ez cara ewil dibihisim ku selawat bi zimanê zazakî tê xwendin.



Serokê Fetwayê ê Diyarbekirê Zeynel Agabeydin Çicek jî dibêje selawat dikare bi zazakî bê dayîn. Li gor dîn ev ne şaş e. Çawa ku kurd, tirk an jî gelên din NÎYETÊ bi zimanê xwe dikin selawat jî eynî tişt e. Ez nizanim qanûn çi dibêje lê li gor dîn rast e.


Amadekar:Mehdi cilgin
Çavkanî :

[Emanoelkurdistani]

@ Serd

Once again :"I'm just sorry for you". Whenever you open your mouth to say something you just make it proved that how much a Turk can be foolish more and more : "...you understood the story after I translate it." "..the Rojbash and Emanoel is on other side." "What you put above to prove thing that is not true is trash anyway."
"We cannot communicate with Kurdish, Turkish, Farsi… speakers with Zazaki [Kirmanckî]." "Zazaki [Kirmanckî] and Kurdish are very far to be even compared." "If Zazaki [Kirmanckî] or Kurdish is going to be a dialect of other..." << Beside your other famous words "70% of Kurdish is Persian" "..can't keep 'her' place with 'his' boring.." etc. <Heq> hv] akin to “hve, hver”.
Also Nynorsk (second official language of Norway) “kor” (=where) shows excellent partnership with Gor. (principally dial. of Krmanşan) “kûră” and Kur. and Krm. “kutră” as well as east.Prussian “kuei” does with Sor. “kwey”, “kwe”.
…….."

Reply :

"dear friend

…..

it's not scientifical to compare and conclude some words about their etimology without knowing the voice laws and the diachronic development of the phonems. so it's not right, if you compare german "god" with iranian "xwadâ" (Zazaki "wayir, wahêr"), which has no etimologic connection or Zazaki "war", kurdish "xwar" with englich "who". the old-iranian xw-, kurdisch xw- oder x-, persian. x-, oldindian sv- is the proto-Indoeuropean *Su-, like engl. sister, sweet, lat. suus, persian xwâhar, xwash, zazaki wae, wesh etc. .

........

with best regards
asmên"

The first post belongs to me and the reply post belongs to Asmêno Bêwayir –who the rest of 10 inhabitants of Zazaistan consider as professor of linguistics (they claim he is studying linguistics in high degrees). He also plays the role of wise man among them. As you see in the first post I claim Kurmancî and Kirmanckî "war" (camp, campground, place) and Soranî "hewar, hwar" share same root with German "wo", Dutch "waar", Swedish "var", Danish and Norwegian "hvor", English "where" etc. But look what he wrote in the reply :"..has no etimologic connection or Zazaki [Kirmanckî] "war", Kurdish "xwar" with englich "who"." <!!!!!! No words to say. This guy –that they claim as linguist- even can't read and analyze. To read and analyze is one of the simplest acts any grown man can do. I compared Kurmancî, Kirmanckî "war" (~ camp, campground, place; Soranî "hewar, hwar" ~ "camp, campground") with English "where" but he answers me that I can't compare Kurmancî, Kirmanckî "war" and Soranî "xwar" (under, down) with English "who"!!!!!! Really no words to say! Also this linguist –that is studyng in high degrees- can't speak English! Look such mistakes he has in only seven lines : "scientifical" [ *scientific], "etimology" [ * etymology], "etimologic" [*etymologic], "phonems"[*phonemes], and "englich" [?!!!,*English], "kurdisch" [?!!,* Kurdish]. Also "german" [*German], "kurdish" [*Kurdish], "persian" [*Persian], "Indoeuropean" [*Indo-European]. This linguist also sounds to be unable to distinguish English and German (or unable to distinguish if he is writing in English or German!!). For evidence : "kurdisch" instead of "Kurdish", "englich" (?!~"englisch") instead of "English" and "oder" instead of "or"!! Look what the hell are these "Zazaistan Ten" while Asmên is their best linguist!

"… and I have devoted my life to stop fascists like you…"
Shut your big mouth! "Pêşmerge"s –by any Kurdish dialect as mother tongue, Kurmancî, Kirmanckî, Soranî, Goranî, by any believes, Sunnite, Alevi, Shiite, Yêzîdî, Communist, Secular, etc., who lost their lives toward freedom for Kurdistan and Kurdistanis –are firm fighters against fascism.

[Emanoelkurdistani]

No doubt that you don’t know a shit about "Shabak Kurds". The only –wrong- information you got are that the Kurdish Shabaks speak is close to Kirmancki and their religious believes is a part of Ehlî Heq. Below I just compare Shabak Kurdish with other Kurdish dialects :

Numbers :

Shabak : Hewramî : Kirmanckî : Soranî : Kurmancî : Persian : English

îkyê : êkwê, ywe : yew : yek : yek, êk : yek [inf. yêk] : one
dû : duî, dwa : di : dû : du : do : two
se : yerî, sa : hîrê : sê : sê : sê : three
çwar : çwar : çar : çwar : çar : çahar [inf. çar] : four
penc : penc : panc : pênc, pînc, penc : pênc : penc : five
şeş : şiş, şeş : şeş : şeş : şeş : şêş [inf. şîş]
haft : hewt, heft : hawt : hewt, heft : heft : heft : seven
heşt : heşt : heşt : heşt : heşt : heyşt, heşt : eight
no : no, now : new, now : no, now : neh : noh : nine
de : de : des : de : deh : deh : ten
wîst : wîst, wîs : vîst : bîst, bîs : bîst : bîst : twenty
sayd : sad, se : se, sey : sed, se : sed : sed : hundred
çaw : çem : çim : çaw : çav : çêşm : eye
xîn : winî, hûn : gûnî : xwên, xên, xwêyn : xwîn : xûn : blood


Colors

Şhabak : Hewramî : Erdellanî : Kirmanckî : Persian : English

çerme : sipî, çerme : çermig : şipî : sêfîd : white
saûs : sawz : sewz : kesk : sebz : green
zerd : zart, zerd : zerd : zerd : zerd : yellow
qermez : sûr : sûr, qirmiz : sûr : sorx, qêrmêz : red
kô : kew : kôg, awî : kewe : abî : blue


Personal Pronouns

Shabak : Hewramî : Soranî : Kirmanckî : Kurmancî : English

emin : min, emin : min, emin : ez : ez : I
tu, etu : tu, etu : to, eto : ti, tu : tu : thou
ew : ew : ew : a/o : ew : he/she
ême, homan/hêman : îme, êma, wêman : ême, xweman/xoman : ma : em : we
şime : şima : êwe : şima : hûn, ewe : you
ewşan : ewşan, adê : ewan : ey : ew : they


Verbal Samples

Şhabak : Hewramî : Erdellanî : Kirmanckî : English

emin zilamê metî : min/emin zelamê mewînû : min zelamê ewînim : ez camêrê vînena/u : î see a man
etu zilamê metî : tu/etu zelamê mewînil : to zelamê ewînît/î : ti/tu camêrê vînena : you see a man
ew zilamê metê : ew zelamê mewîno : ew/ô zelamê ewînê/t : o/a camêrê vîneno/a : he/she sees a man
ême zilamê metîmî : ême/êma zelamê mewînîm : ême zelamê ewînîm/n : ma camêrê vînemî : we see a man
şima zilamê metê : şima zelamê mewînde : êwe zelamê ewînin : şima camêrê vînenê : you see a man
ewşan zilamê meto : ewşan zelamê mewîna : ewan zelamê ewînin : ey camêrê vînenê : they see a man


The above comparisons easily prove that the Kurdish Shabaks speak is closer to Hewramî rather than any other Kurdish dialects or other languages.

[Vladimir]

Can you tell me what this article says Emannuel? (From Netkurd in Kurmanci).

[Emanoelkurdistani]

Can you tell me what this article says Emannuel? (From Netkurd in Kurmanci).

Forbidder deputy prohibited praying in Kirmancki [dialect of Kurdish] too.

We heard Mustafa Altipinar's, vice commander of Pîran, name while he was vice commander of Sutculer area –İsparta city, western Turkey- and banned Orhan Pamuki's books. Altipinar had ordered to ban Orhan Pamuki's books in libraries and afterwards the government send him to Pîran, Diyarbakir area.

After that vice commander came to Pîran straightly started to ban some other things. First banned it to play –perform- in Kurdish for NÇM performance group.

Then attended to youth football and did not let them to play football. Finally he put a tall wall between his home and house of Pîran's mayor and said "If DTP's were contented of me I would die of hatred"

Now deputy Altipinar has prohibited to pray in Kirmancki on dead bodies [~ an Islamic custom called "Selat Meyyit"; to say pray for dead body before putting it in a grave] and ordered to say pray in Turkish instead of Kirmancki.

Pîran's mufti, Arif Yeşiloğlu, says "yesterday I prayed –on the dead body of a woman- in Turkish. Previously we used to pray in Kirmancki but now we are forced to pray in Turkish.

Mayor Abdullah Akengin said "for years we have prayed in Kirmancki. It's our people's speech which we they understand it. People doesn’t want to pray in Turkish. To pray in Kirmancki isn’t against Islamic instructions. Praying must be in the language that guys understand. No body contributed in the burying because it's praying was in Turkish. If it was in Kirmancki so many guys would contribute in burying.

Deputy Abdullah Altipinar said he doesn’t want to express his spots at present time.

Vice governor of Diyarbakir, Canan Hancer Baştürk, says "to choose the language of praying depends on mufti's determination. As I know [they-] say pray in Arabic. Vice commander can not bring about if they prayed in Kurdish. But all officials are under vice commander's command. Vice commander can command and inquire. The subject –due it's a religious topic- is sensitive. It's for first time I hear that [they-] say pray in Kirmancki.

Head of Fatwa [mufti azam] of Diyarbakir, Zeynel Ağabeydin Çiçek, says according to the Islam it's not wrong to pray in Kirmancki. As Kurds, Turks and other folks say "niyat" in their mother tongue, praying could be said in any tongue too. I don’t know what the law says about it but according to Islam it's right.

[Serd]

Let me correct the translation first.

Forbidder deputy prohibited praying in Zazaish too.

We heard Mustafa Altipinar's, vice commander of Pîran, name while he was vice commander of Sutculer area –İsparta city, western Turkey- and banned Orhan Pamuki's books. Altipinar had ordered to ban Orhan Pamuki's books in libraries and afterwards the government send him to Pîran, Diyarbakir area.

After that vice commander came to Pîran straightly started to ban some other things. First banned it to play –perform- in Kurdish for NÇM performance group.

Then attended to youth football and did not let them to play football. Finally he put a tall wall between his home and house of Pîran's mayor and said "If DTP's were contented of me I would die of hatred"

Now deputy Altipinar has prohibited to pray in Zazaish on dead bodies [~ an Islamic custom called "Selat Meyyit"; to say pray for dead body before putting it in a grave] and ordered to say pray in Turkish instead of Zazaish.

Pîran's mufti, Arif Yeşiloğlu, says "yesterday I prayed –on the dead body of a woman- in Turkish. Previously we used to pray in Zazaish but now we are forced to pray in Turkish.

Mayor Abdullah Akengin said "for years we have prayed in Zazaish. It's our people's speech which we they understand it. People doesn’t want to pray in Turkish. To pray in Zazaish isn’t against Islamic instructions. Praying must be in the language that guys understand. No body contributed in the burying because it's praying was in Turkish. If it was in Zazaish so many guys would contribute in burying.

Deputy Abdullah Altipinar said he doesn’t want to express his spots at present time.

Vice governor of Diyarbakir, Canan Hancer Baştürk, says "to choose the language of praying depends on mufti's determination. As I know [they-] say pray in Arabic. Vice commander can not bring about if they prayed in Zazaish. But all officials are under vice commander's command. Vice commander can command and inquire. The subject –due it's a religious topic- is sensitive. It's for first time I hear that [they-] say pray in Zazaish.

Head of Fatwa [mufti azam] of Diyarbakir, Zeynel Ağabeydin Çiçek, says according to the Islam it's not wrong to pray in Zazaish. As Zazas, Kurds, Turks and other folks say "niyat" in their mother tongue, praying could be said in any tongue too. I don’t know what the law says about it but according to Islam it's right.

Now, this looks better.

Piran’s kaymakam is your chauvinist brother. He wants to melt us in the
Turkishness; you want to melt us in the Kurdishness. But, this won’t
happen simply because I and my Zaza friends are very proud of our
Zazaish identity. We are the grandchildren of the great Parthian Empire.

Anyway, I think the Turkish government's attempt to Turkify Zaza people
is the greatest danger for Zazas. Many times, it is hard to fight against
them since there is a great power inbalance. The treat that rojbash and
et. al poise to the Zazaish people can be ignorable compared the
Turkification attempts of the Turkish government. You can only right about
your dreams in the internet forums. Nothing else.

[Serd]

@ Emanoella

Neither Shabaki nor Hewrami is a Kurdish dialect.

I think it is you, who is Turkish-Mongol. I don’t see how my insistence to
embrace my ethnic identity and my language makes me a Turkish. But, I
can tell you that you have the same mind like them.

They also say anything spoken in Turkey is a kind of Turkish dialect, even
Zazaki, Lazuri, Kurdi, and so on. Obviously, you are making the same
kind of f#@king arguments all the time in this forum. If we accept what
chauvinists like you say, Kurdish will have more dialects than Chinese
even though the word Kurd doesn’t appear anywhere in pre-islamic
history. However, Darius, the Great refers the Zaza inhabited area as
Zazana some 2500 years ago.

I am not sure what you are trying to prove by putting those word tables
here in this forum, but it looks like Kurdi is a dialect of Farsi.

Zazaki : Kurdi (Kurdmanci) : Farsi : English

yew : yek : yek : one
di : du : do : two
hiri : sê : sê : three
çar : çar : çahar [inf. çar] : four
punc : pênc : penc : five
şeş : şeş : şeş;
hewt, : heft : heft : seven
heşt : heşt, heşt : eight
new : neh : noh : nine
des : deh : deh : ten
vîst : bîst : bîst : twenty


Anyway, I consider Kurdi as a dialect of Zazaki, along with Shabaki and
Hewrami.

Bicewe Zazaki, bicewe Zazana.

[Vladimir]

"An alternative historical name for Dersim is that of Zazana, mentioned in B.C. 521 in the old Persion inscription of Behistun. " - RadioZaza.

[1.19] Says Darius the king: Afterwards I went to Babylon; when I had not reached Babylon - there (is) a town '''Zazana''' by name along the Euphrates - there this Nidintu-Bel who called himself Nebuchadrezzar went with his army against me to engage in battle; afterwards we engaged in battle; Auramazda bore me aid; by the grace of Auramazda the army of Nidintu-Bel I smote utterly; the enemy were driven into the water; the water bore them away; 2 days in the month Anamaka were in course - we thus engaged in battle.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/txt/ah/Persi ... n_txt.html

[Vladimir]

You don't know much about Hewrami then, if you don't see it as a Kurdish dialect Serd. Land of Karda/Karduchi/Gilani is already mentioned before Islam. Some connect Gurti/Kurdi/Karda/Kardochi with eachother. Zozan is also a Kurdish name by the way..

[baskurd]

zazaki dont exist they are turks..pretending

[Vladimir]

Lot of people create fake account apparantly..

[Serd]

zazaki dont exist they are turks..pretending

Stupid "Cazyun" has come back.

[baskurd]

zazaki is irani.

[Emanoelkurdistani]

@ Serd

Once again after the last time "I'm just sorry for you". It's proven that you can't grasp any social meanings. Exactly your IQ is equal to a rotten carrot. For evidence : "We are the grandchildren of Parthian empire" ".. since there is a great power inbalance.""You can only right about your dreams…" Neither Shabak nor Hewramî is a Kurdish dialect." "If we accept what chauvinists like you say, Kurdish will have more dialects than Chinese…" ".. the word Kurd doesn’t appear anywhere in pre-islamic history. However, Darius, the Great refers the Zaza inhabited area as Zazana some 2500 years ago." ".. it looks like Kurdi is a dialect of Farsi." "Anyway I consider Kurdi as a dialect of Zazaki along with Shabaki and Hewrami." Beside your other –renowned- silly quotes :"..can't keep her place with his boring…" "70% of Kurdish is Persian." "… games which has just began." etc. You even have inability in reading or looking : "@ Emanoella". I just doubt if it –to have some kind of inability in reading or looking- is common between "Zazaîstan Ten" or not, as Asmên has shown some evidences testifying it ~ Heq şifa bido!


"Neither Shabaki nor Hewrami is a Kurdish dialect."
"I am not sure what you are trying to prove…"

My past posts and the comparisons they contain, make it clear that Kirmanckî is closest to Hewramî-Goranî. Also it shares some significant grammatical, morphological and lexical similarities with Kurmancî and Soranî. Some of these similarities are just special to Kurmancî and Kirmanckî (e.g. Kurmancî "xwe" or "xo", Kirmanckî "xo" or "xu" which accept no pronominal suffixes but all other Iranian languages and dialects have pronominal suffixes in this case : Persian "xwedem" "inf. xodem", "xwedet" "inf. xodêt", "xwedeş" "inf. xodêş", "xwedêman" "xodêmûn", .., Soranî, Lekî "xwem" "xom", "xwet" "xot", "xwey" "xoy", "xweman" "xoman"…, Hewramî "wêm", "wêt", …, Shabak "hom", "hot",…, Gîlekî "xûdim", "xûdit",.., etc). About Hewramî-Goranî and Kurmancî branches issue, at first linguistics claimed the Hewramî-Goranî branch (consisting of Hewramî, Kelhûr, Zengene, Lekî, Kirmanckî [so-called Zazakî or Dimîlkî], Shabak, Bacelan, etc.) as purest Kurdish. But further theories and states claimed it's not so and even considered Hewramî-Goranî branch as non-Kurdish! What was wrong? The point is that main body of Kurds speak Kurmancî branch varieties (Kurmancî and Soranî both). Therefore they concluded if the Kurmancî branch is considered to hold "Kurdish" term then the Hewramî-Goranî branch is not Kurdish!! By their view –right or false- Hewramî-Goranî branch is different comparing with Kurmancî branch. But indeed Hewramî-Goranî branch –if we even would consider it and Kurmancî branch as different branchs- is independent and unique. They just –foolishly- ignored that Hewramî-Goranî –as a unique branch- is spoken by the people who call their selves "Kurd" and there is no difference between them and Kurmancî speaking folks as "Kurds". Even most of Hewramî-Goranî speaking Kurds consider their selves as purest Kurds (such as Kakaîs, speaking Hewramî, Yarêsans who speak Hewramî and Lekî and Hewramî speaking Sunnite Kurds). The newest theory, which seems to be scientific, considers a Kurdic (Kurdish) group consisting of Kurmancî and Hewramî-Goranî branches both. Anyway there is no doubt that Kirmanckî is a dialect of Hewramî-Goranî branch of Kurdish.


"…I and my Zaza friends are very proud of our Zazaish identity."

Which identity are you talking about? The identity which there isn’t any trace of it before 1970s!!!?? The identity by which only less than 100 guys identify their selves!!! The identity which is created by dumb-minded Turkfied, so-called, intellectuals according to Turkish government's command in order to make inner issues among Kurds (e.g. creating the fake story –by Turkish intelligence services- that there is an aged Kirmanckî speaker in a village around Dêrsim who has memorized the stories of Celalûddin –Khwarzamshahi Prince- battles and thus claimed that Kimanckî speaking Kurds are originated from Khurasan!!! They just a bit later revealed that it was a fake story). Back to your false/inexistent identity. The false-inexistent identity you talk about is better to call "association of pro-hallucinatory", "community of dreamers" or whatever.


"We are the grandchildren of the great Parthian Empire."

I don’t know how many times I must pvss you off!

For first time dumb-minded Turkfied guys like you claimed Kirmanckî Kurdish is closer to Persian rather than other Kurdish dialects!!! After realizing that it's nothing but a piece of nonsense they claimed that Kirmanckî is a part of Northern Iranian languages and shares so many similarities with Talyshi. They –still- frequently claim that Kirmanckî is descended from Talyshi, Gîlekî or Mazenderanî. Recently those mindless guys according to some –only some- linguistic researches claimed that there is a fair connection between Kirmanckî Kurdish and Parthian and eventually the most dumb0minded member of them, you, therefore considers himself as grandchild of Parthian Empire!!!! [ Heq şifa bido.]. It's a fact – a flat fact- that Parthian shares so many similarities and traces so many links with Northwestern Iranian languages. An article on this matter claimed that Baluchi and in occasion Kirmanckî share some especial similarities with Parthian language. These similarities become especial when it claimed that such similarities don’t exist in Kurdish (~ Kurmancî Kurdish). If they don’t exist in Kurmancî Kurdish and exist in Kirmanckî then it's so interesting and makes it proved Kirmanckî Kurdish is close to the Parthian language in an especially manner! But in the article it seems that there is no Hewramî-Goranî speech which Kirmanckî Kurdish is descended from it. The article uses some Kirmanckî words and grammatical articles such as "çim", "zama", "-ên", etc. for evidence but doesn’t mention that those words directly exist in Hewramî-Goranî Kurdish too!! Also comparing Kirmanckî with Kurmancî and concluding that Kirmanckî shares especial similarities with Parthian automatically proves that the article considers both speeches as close dialects (with no mention to Hewramî-Goranî varieties). I don’t know what is wrong. It's proven that Kirmanckî Kurdish is a branch of Hewramî-Goranî branch and Kurmancî Kurdish belongs to the other Kurdish branch. But what it means to compare differences between Kurmancî and Kirmanckî and concluding that Kirmanckî shares more similarities with Parthian with no respect to the fact that all mentioned similarities exist –in a wider sphere- in Hewramî-Goranî too?!! Anyway they are going to get the pic that Kirmanckî is closest to the Hewramî-Goranî and each Kurdish dialect shares more –or at least equal- similarities with any other Iranian languages than Kirmanckî dialect.
I'm sure that you don’t know a shit about Parthian Empire and Parthian people and Parthian language too (as you didn’t know about the Kurdish Shabaks speak, even after my comparisons –and proven linguistic facts- you are as dumb-minded –due your null IQ- as come and say "…I consider Kurdi as a dialect of Zazaki [Kirmanckî Kurdish], along with Shabaki and Hewrami."!!!)

Parth (also "Perthu", "Pehlu*", "Pehelh*", "Felheh*", etc in ancient Persian) province was one of the royal provinces of Achaemenid dynasty included today's northern Khorasan and parts of southern Turkmenistan. In 247 BC Arsac (Erşk or Eşk) revolted against the Saluki king with the help of his brother, Tirdad, and founded the Arsacide (Eşkanî) dynasty.

The Parthian language which also is called Pahlavi* Pahlavani*and Parthian Pahlavi is one of Iran's middle languages (Northwestern Branch). Other middle Iranian languages which have the same roots as Parthian include: Saqdi (Sogdian), Khwarazmian, Sakai, Balkhi and Sassanian Pahlavi* (middle Persian). The most ancient works in Parthian language date back to 100 BC. This language was used until about the 4th century or the 6th AD and eventually became forgotten.

Works Written in the Parthian Language (Parthian handwritings) :

1. Earthenware : (places found ~) In ancient Nesa city, Ghumes (Damghan, Iran), Nayepour (Iraq), Kousheh Tieh and Marv (Turkmenistan).

2. Hewraman leathers : 3 pieces of leather found in Hewraman, two in Greek and one is in Parthian.

3. Coins, stamps and jewelry : In territory of Aloumise kingdom, Sistan (Baluchistan) and parts of India.

4. Short stone manuscripts : In Georgia, Birjand (Khûrasan) and Pakistan.

5. Inscription of Belash IV on Hercules status : In Iraq.

6. The inscription of gravestone of Khavasag : Shoush (Khûzistan)

7. Sassanide manuscripts : In role of Rustam (Fars)

8. Petrograph of Shahpour : In eastern Kurdistan

9. Stone manuscripts of Shapour : In Haji Abad and Tong Baraq and Kazeroun and Role of Rustam and Role of Rajab (Fars)

10. Stone manuscripts of Narseh (Sassanide king) : In Suleymania (southern Kurdistan)

It's really funny how come there is no trace of Great Parthian Empire heritage in the territory of its grandchildren!! It's funny too that how its grandchildren live thousand of miles away from the homeland (Northern Khûrasan). Though Persians (descendants of ancient Persians) have Fars province (homeland of ancient Persians) as their heartland or Kurds (descendants of ancient Kurds ~ Medes) still live in the territory of Media (modern Kurdistan) or Mazanis (as descendants of Tabarians) still live in ancient Tabaristan (modern Mazandaran) but descendants of Parthians live thousands of miles away from the ancient Parth, in where you can find no trace of Parthian heritage!! Dumb-minded Turkfied guy, Mehmet Bingöl, every time you state such nonsense things guys just make fun of you. Just open your eyes and see the reality. Kirmanckî speaking Kurds, from any religion Alevi or Sunnite Muslim, are "Kurd"! As I know you understand Turkish better than any other language –even better than your mother tongue, Kirmanckî Kurdish- : "Aslini İnkar Eden Haramzadadır".

Here is a brief table comparing Parthian words with their closest equal words (if any exist) in modern Iranian languages :

Parthian : Kirmanckî : other Kurdish dial. : other Iranian lang. : English

ebdab : ------- : hetaw [Mûkriyanî] : afto [Gîlekî, Tatî], aftab [Persian] : sun
abdês- : va- : bêj- , wêş- [Lekî], waç- [Hewramî] : vac- [Tatî] : tell, explain, say
amêg : ------- : mêje [Erdellanî] : amîzê [Persian] : mixture
ay : bê : bê : biya, ay [Persian] : come
ebaj : ------- : paş, pişt : poşt : peş [Raji] : back
ebaxter : vakûr : bakûr : ------- : north
ebder : ------- : ewder, wire [Lekî] : ------- : yonder
ebdên : ------- : -------- : abtîn [Persian] : costum, manner, way
ebhîşt : ------- : ------- : ------- : left
eber, eberên : ------- : bangîn, bangên [Erdellanî] : ------- : upper
ebxiros : ------- : qêrre, xiroş : xorûş [~attack, Persian] : shriek, call
ebexşahîşin : ------- : bexşîn : bexşîden [Persian, Tatî] : pardon, pity
ebyadger : ------- : yadgarî, yadigarî : yadêgarî [Persian] : memorable
-ger : -------- : -ger, -gar [Erdellanî] : -------- : pl. suffix ~ -s, -es (though this suffix exists almost in all Iranian languages in the words such as "yadgar", "rûzgar" etc. but only in Erdellanî Soranî it's used as plural sign, e.g. "rojger", "şewger", "malger", "kurdger" etc.)

*Perthu, Pehlu, Pehelh, Fhleh, Pahlavani, Pahlavi. Pehle an ancient region and a city south of Îlam, southern Kurdistan. Goranî varieties is spoken in the region. Also Kirmaşanî Kurds call theirselves "Pallewan" (~Pahlavan).



"I don’t see how my insistence to embrace my ethnic identity and my language makes me a Turkish."

Every one's name is the way the others can identify him/her. "Mehmet Bingöl" is completely a Turkish name ; "Mehmet" ~Turkfied form of Arabic "Muhammad", Kurdish "Mihemmed, Heme"), "Bingöl" ~Fake –Turkish- name of Çewlîg, northern Kurdistan. Your last name –plus being completely Turkish- is anti-Kurdish –specially against Çewlîgî Kurds-.
Beside your Turkish name, your beliefs are Turkfied and pro-Turk. As I said before you follow the beliefs created by Turkish Fascism.


"However, Darius, the Great refers the Zaza inhabited area as Zazana some 2500 years ago."


Column 1
19. Says Darius the king : Afterwards I went to Babylon … there (is) a town Zazana by name along the Euphrates- there this Nidintu-Bel who called himself Nebuchadrezzar went with his army against me to engage in battle … I smote utterly … we thus engaged in battle.

The modern Dêrsim (Turkish "Tunçeli") is located in northern Kurdistan (eastern Turkey). Babylonian homeland originally contained today's southern and –somehow- central Iraq plus some parts of southwestern Khuzistan province of Iran. But the Babylonia in its greatest extent also contained today's Khuzistan province wholly, southern Kurdistan (Iraqi Kurdistan), northern and central Syria, northern Kurdistan (southern Turkey, along Iraqi and Syrian borders) Adana area, regions south of Kayseri to the Mediterranean shores (both in Turkey), Lebanon, and Israel Bu the people living in the areas I mentioned were not Babylonian in fact. They were Elamite (Khuzistan), Assyrian, Mede (Iraqi Kurdistan, Northern Kurdistan), Assyrian and other Semitic races (Syria), Semitic and Aryan races (Adana, Mediterranean shores), Jews and other Semitic races (Lebanon, Israel).
Dêrsim is hardly located on the edge of northern Babylonian borders by the time Babylonia had its greatest extent. According to the Behistun inscription "Nidintu-Bel" –from Zazana town- was Babylonian :

Column 1
16. Says Darius the king : When I slew Gaumata the Magian, afterwards … and there (was) one man a "Babylonian" Nidintu-Bel by name, the son of Aniri', he rose up in Babylon; thus he deceived the people; I am Nebuchadrezzar the son of Nabu-na'id; afterwards … the kingdom in Babylon he seized.

Plus the direct mention of the text that he was Babylonian also his name, his father's name and the name by which he deceived people are pure Babylonian names all.

Column 1
18. Says Darius the king : Afterwards … the army of Nidintu-Bel held the Tigris; there he halted and thereby was a flotilla; afterwards I placed my army on floats of skin … -we thus engaged in battle.

As we know Zazana was located along Euphrates but the Nidintu-Bel held the Tigris and there was a battle in which Babylonians and Iranian engaged. This fact follows that the distance between Zazana (as a town located along Euphrates) and Tigris was small. Thus Zazana was located in central or southern Iraq (about 400 km south of Nineveh), where the distance between Euphrates and Tigris is smallest. Also the inscription mentions that there was a battle on the Tigris and Babylonian insurgents had a flotilla and Iranian army got placed on floats of skin. This fairly proves that Zazana was located in today's central or southern Iraq, the only where that is able to use floats or flotillas on Tigris and also is close to the Euphrates.

Column 1
19. Says Darius the king : Afterwards I went to Babylon; when I had not reached Babylon – there (is) a town Zazana by name … - we thus engaged in battle.
Column 2
1. Says Darius the king : Afterwards Nidintu-Bel with (his) few horsemen went to Babylon, afterwards I went to Babylon … I both seized Babylon and seized that Nidintu-Bel,; afterwards I slew Nidintu-Bel at Babylon.

Darius says he has conquered Zazana before reaching Babylon. It's another evidence that proves Zazana was somewhere fairly close to Babylon (if not located under Babylon) because Darius first conquered Babylon then kept his conquests on toward north and west (where today's Dêrsim is located).

Beside the facts like Babylonian identity of Zazana, Babylonian identity of the Babylonian rebellious or geographical facts. To be beside the Euphrates is the only logical link between Dêrsim and Babylonian Zazana! As I know thousands of cities, villages and ancient places share such similarity too! There is no other connection between Dêrsim and ancient Babylonian Zazana. Zazana as a Babylonian ordinary town populated by Babylonians, Semitics, and located in the Babylonian homeland, today's central and southern Iraq, has nothing in common with modern Dêrsim located in northern Kurdistan and populated by Kurds, Indo-Europeans, except being along Euphrates!
What's wrong with Radio Zaza or the guys claimed Zazana as an ancient alternative for Dêrsim (same Hêgmedane or Ecbatana for Hemedan and Sayna or Saynadêj for Sine, etc.)? Once they claim Northern Iranian languages, specially Talyshi, share more similarities with Kirmanckî Kurdish than Kurmancî. Another day they consider Gilaki to share so many similarities with Kirmanckî Kurdish rather than any other speech or claim Mazandarani, Tabarian, to be closest to Kirmanckî Kurdish. And eventually claim Kirmanckî Kurdish to be descended from Parthian language and Kirmanckî speaking Kurds as Parthian descendants!!! The point is that to create a fake identity requires to create a fake history. Though as I know it's for first time in the entire world's history some guys try to create an identity! Exactly trying to create any identity is false. It is same as creating a language and forcing guys to accept it as mother tongue! National identities have been founded through millenniums. Every nation has its own unique –common- history, traditions, etc. It's not like a childish game to wake up once, looking at sunrise and saying "I will create an identity today, here I am!"!!! Some guys are as dumb as try to create –fake- identities, afterwards get that there is no background and history for the identity on which they are insisting.
About the Kirmanckî speaking Kurds; there are two differences between them and their Kurmancî speaking neighbours : 1. The Kurdish dialects they speak 2. Their religious beliefs. As a linguistic fact the Kirmanckî Kurdish belongs to Hewramî-Goranî branch but the Kurmancî (~Northern Kurmancî) Kurdish belongs to Kurmancî branch. Both branches are solely spoken by Kurds. And about religious beliefs most of Kirmanckî speaking Kurds and a significant number of Kurmancî speaking Kurds are Alevi. Alevism itself is a part of Ehl-î-Heq with some additional costumes borrowed from Christianity. Ehl-î-Heq and other Sufî orders (terîqe) are founded and developed mainly in Kurdistan and most of their true followers are Kurdish. Also most of Sufis to whom the followers revere are Kurdish (e.g. Pîr Bênyamîn, Pîr Şahoyî, Îl Beygî Caf, Shaykh Çelepî [who Mewlana considered himself as his Mûrîd], Shaykh Sefieddîn [founder of Qizilbaş sect and Iranian Twelfth Imami Shiite, also the Buyruk, holy book of Shabak Kurds, is referred to him] etc.). There is no doubt that the language Kirmancki speaking Kurds speak is Kurdish and their religious beliefs (Alevi or Sunnite) is common with other Kurds. All beside the flat fact that Kirmanckî speaking Kurds (Alevi or Sunnite) consider their selves as Kurds.
Back to the mindless guys who got to seek ancient Iranian inscriptions in order to find something suitable to link their fake –traceless- identity to. When there is no background, no history and nothing at all to definite their fake identity, the only thing they can do is to clasp the linguistic theories, in a silly manner, and emphasizing that the Kirmanckî Kurdish shares some similarities with Northern Iranian languages or Parthian language over and over. It's obviously in a silly manner because they don’t respect to the fact that Hewramî-Goranî Kurdish branch shares some significant similarities with Northern Iranian languages and Parthian language thus Kirmanckî Kurdish, as a member of this branch, does so. Declaring that Gilaki shares similarities with Kirmanckî Kurdish, Kirmanckî Kurdish is so close to Talyshi, Kirmanckî Kurdish is descended from Mazandarani, Kirmanckî speaking Kurds are descendants of Daylamians but the Kurdish they speak is descended from Semnani language, the classical Persian verb "şoden" (~to become, to go) is close to Kirmanckî Kurdish "şiyaene" (~to go, with no respect to the fact that except current Persian "reften", Lûrî and Bextiyarî "reftin, rewîn" and Mazandarani "bûrdin" all other Iranian languages share the same similarity too : Goranî varieties "şûn, şîn, şîîn", Gilaki "şon, şûn", Kurmancî and Soranî "çûn" [ç<ş, "şûn"], Baluchi "şûtag", Sogdian "şodene", Talyshi "şeê", etc.) and so on. Such childish states which can only delude ordinary guys, like Mehmet Bingöl, all are caused by the fact that founders of the fake identity know better they exactly have nothing to prove their false theories. Just jumping from the present side to the next one repetitively (e.g. today linking Kirmanckî Kurdish to Talyshi, tomorrow, to Gilaki, …, Mazandarani, Semnani, Parthian, etc.) Their repetitive jumping is exactly running from the truth. They run away whenever they face the reality and as the reality is the only thing which is stable forever (according to the Ehlî Heq beliefs : Her heq memêne!), they will repetitively run and change the side forever.
Also the Turkish government has been always the greatest supporter of this fake identity in initial times of its creation (e.g. fake story about aged villager from Dêrsim region who had memorized the stories of Khwarazmshahian Prince's battles, made by Turkish intelligence services). To make a fake identity in order to make inner issues amongst Kurds is a fair opportunity for Republic of Crime, Turkey. The first obvious employing of this opportunity, as I remember, was 3 years ago that Turkey government while giving some authorities to Kurds (e.g. writing in Kurdish and –somehow- broadcasting in Kurdish) just ignored Kirmanckî speaking Kurds and gave those authorities to Kurmancî speaking Kurds only. Turkish government explained that Kirmanckî speaking Kurds aren’t Kurdish and their language isn’t Kurdish. They are Zaza, Kirmanckî, Dimilkî, totally Alevi, with some significant number of Turkish ethnics among their selves and just compose a little minority in Turkey and aren’t as large as Kurds (Kurmancî speaking Kurds) thus it's not fair to give them the same authorities!! Indeed existence of such a fake identity is a fair opportunity for Turkey. Turkey still prohibits writing and broadcasting in Kirmanckî Kurdish for up 3 millions of local Kirmanckî Kurdish speakers. Therefore there would be nothing but quick replacement of mother tongue, today's Kirmanckî Kurdish speakers tomorrow's Turkish speakers, beside making inner issues amongst Kurds.
Anyway the fact is that the Kirmanckî speaking Kurds, Alevi or Sunnite, are ethnic "Kurds" who also consider themselves so. As the Ehlî Heq instructions declare "The Truth (Heq) is the only thing remaining!"


"… even though the word Kurd doesn’t appear anywhere in pre-islamic history."
Well it's a flat fact that not only you, as an ordinary and most dumb-minded member, but all followers of this fake identity are followers of falsehood. Such words and quotes are just resulted from your null IQ rotten carrot.
Talmud holds that Jewish deportees were settled in "Kurdistan" by Assyrian around 2800 years ago. As indicated in the Talmud, the Jews eventually were given permission by rabbinic authorities to convert local "Kurds". They were exceptionally successful in their endeavor. The illustrious "Kurdish" royal house of Adiabene, with Arbil as its capital, was converted to Judaism in the course of the 1st century BC (about 2100 years ago).
The Kayus (also House of Kayus) or Soranî "Kavûsekan" was a semi-independent "Kurdish" kingdom in central and southern "Kurdistan" established in 226 CE. The House of Kayus after an agreement between "Kurdish" principalities and kingdoms and the Persian Empire, following a two-year war between the Empire and the local kingdoms. A local "Kurdish" prince, Kayus, reinstated tributary king to rule the Kurds. Prior to the establishment of the House of Kayus, a number of unified "Kurdish"principalities and kingdoms from Barzan and Hakkarî to Mûkriyan and Şarezor ruled under the leadership of the kingdom of Kêrm in Kirmaşan.
The "Guti" or "Kurdu" were reduced to subjection by Cyrus before he descended upon Babylon. In the later times they passed successfully under the sway of the Macedonians, the Parthians, and Sassanids. They were befriended by the Arsacide monarchs. Gotarzes whose name may perhaps be translated "chief of the Guti", is traditionally believed to be the founder of Gorans, the principal tribe of southern Kurdistan. His name and titles are preserved in a Greek inscription at Behistun near the Kurdish city of Kirmaşan (Persian "Kêrmanşah")
For the year 190 BC (2197 years ago), the Roman historian, Livy, records the presence of several thousand of "Kurdish" soldiers fighting in the army of Antiochus III.
A very early record of confrontation between "Kurds" and Sassanid Empire appears in a historical text named "Book of the Deeds of Ardashir son of Babak" (Erdeşîr Babekan), in this book explains the battle between Ardashir and Madig king of the "Kurds" in the early 3rd century. This battle has also reported by Persian poet "Firdawsi" in his epic "Shahnama" (Volume 6, Chapter 61,71,72), in which the name of the "Kurdish King" appears as "Madik".
Some Middle Persian sources suggest "Kurdish" deportation, particularly in the later Sassanid era. In addition to deport of a number of the "Barzanis" to the province of Carmanian (modern Kêrman, southeastern Iran).
In the eats the "Kurdish" kingdoms of "Cortea", "Media", "Kirm" (Kêrm), and "Adiabene" had, by the first century BC, become confederate members of the Parthian Federation.
The above texts are just a small amount of the ancient history of Kurds. Persian calendar dates ~2550 though Kurdish calendar dates 2706 (2618). All Iranian people consider Kurds as the purest Iranian people who have preserved their purity through the history. But the mindless dumb-minded guys with null IQ, like you, come and state such nonsense words. Indeed the history of Kurds does not only contain pre-Islamic period but also contains pre-Christianity period too as we are going to celebrate Kurdish new year, Newroja 2707 (2619), seven days later.

Newroj Pîroz

".. but it looks like Kurdi is a dialect of Farsi."
Another nonsense quote from a dumb-minded Turkfied guy.
Kurmancî (Kurdmancî) : Persian : Informal Persian
êk, yek : yek : yêk
du, didu, di : do : do
sê : sê : sê
çar : çehar : çahar, çar
pênc : penc : penc, penş
şeş : şêş : şîş
heft : heft : hef, heft
heyşt, heşt : heşt : heş, heşt
neh : noh : noh
deh : deh : deh

No need to explain the differences between Kurmancî Kurdish and Persian. But about numerals it should be said that that two one of Kurmancî Kurdish numerals seem to be loaned from Persian : "neh" and "deh". Kurmancî "neh" (Soranî, Goranî, Kirmanckî "now, n¬o") cannot be loaned from Persian. It has never been occurred in any Kurmancî varieties to change "-oh" in "-eh", if we even supposed "neh" to be loaned from Persian "noh". It could be "ne" (derived from "new") with a final "h" as additional. Adding "h" (initial, medial or final) is found in a wide extent in Northern Kurmancî Kurdish varieties, e.g. "hesp" (esp), pehîz (peyîz, payîz), duh (dwe, dû). Also there isn’t such habit in Persian to explain so. Beside Persian and Kurmancî Kurdish we can find Gilaki "noh", Tati "nih", and Lûrî "nuh" which could be supposed to be loaned from Persian.
To follow habit of adding "h" could be supposed about "deh" too. Also in other Indo-Iranian languages we have Tati "deh", Baluchi "deh, dih", Lûrî "deh", Sinhalese "deheye", Maldivian "dîhe", Marathi "dihe", Sindhi "dehe", and Assamese "dih".
The other numbers could be doubtlessly considered as pure Kurmancî Kurdish numbers which are common among most of Iranian languages and in occasion are fairly interesting (e.g. "heyşt" eight).

[Emanoelkurdistani]

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